Comments on: Using Turkish in the Classroom http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/ Down into the rabbit hole of ELT in Turkey (and now China) Wed, 11 Jan 2012 15:48:16 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: admin http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/comment-page-1/#comment-15 admin Thu, 22 Oct 2009 20:18:05 +0000 http://turklishtefl.com/?p=90#comment-15 Hmm yes, always a danger. I've responded to a beginner class in Turkish for the first week of the class a few times and then, after the first couple days, just told them that I wouldn't be doing that anymore now that they were comfortable with me. I would just play dumb when they spoke in Turkish and they got the point by day 2 :) They'll understand if you explain your reasoning, at least they have for me. If you do it too much or too long it's very hard to get the class to switch. I've read stories online of teachers who this has happened to. Thanks for stopping by the blog :) Hmm yes, always a danger. I’ve responded to a beginner class in Turkish for the first week of the class a few times and then, after the first couple days, just told them that I wouldn’t be doing that anymore now that they were comfortable with me. I would just play dumb when they spoke in Turkish and they got the point by day 2 :) They’ll understand if you explain your reasoning, at least they have for me. If you do it too much or too long it’s very hard to get the class to switch. I’ve read stories online of teachers who this has happened to. Thanks for stopping by the blog :)

]]> By: Ty Kendall http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/comment-page-1/#comment-14 Ty Kendall Thu, 22 Oct 2009 17:46:46 +0000 http://turklishtefl.com/?p=90#comment-14 Interesting article Nick. I agree with everything you say. L1 use in the classroom can be beneficial if boundaries are set. It reminds me of when I was teaching a Cypriot group and they found out I am learning Greek..they were a low-level group and they instantly switched to speaking to me in Greek...which was disasterous as they suddenly refused to go back to English...it became a game of wits...I had to convince them my Greek wasn't good enough to converse with them and that I wasn't in that lesson to learn Greek, they were there to learn English. The students do warm to you though if they see that whilst they are taking steps to learn your language, you have done the same. Interesting article Nick. I agree with everything you say. L1 use in the classroom can be beneficial if boundaries are set.
It reminds me of when I was teaching a Cypriot group and they found out I am learning Greek..they were a low-level group and they instantly switched to speaking to me in Greek…which was disasterous as they suddenly refused to go back to English…it became a game of wits…I had to convince them my Greek wasn’t good enough to converse with them and that I wasn’t in that lesson to learn Greek, they were there to learn English.
The students do warm to you though if they see that whilst they are taking steps to learn your language, you have done the same.

]]> By: turklis1 http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/comment-page-1/#comment-11 turklis1 Wed, 14 Oct 2009 19:22:54 +0000 http://turklishtefl.com/?p=90#comment-11 Here, I definitely agree with you. Here is a point where we could go either way as to the efficacy of the approach. However, I feel we can say for certain that teaching a lesson entirely in L1 is extremely ineffective, especially for productive skills. That is my point. At some point we can go either way, but there are basic practices that should be followed by anyone. I mean, I'm agreeing with you here, but I'm saying that we can only take it so far. Here, I definitely agree with you. Here is a point where we could go either way as to the efficacy of the approach. However, I feel we can say for certain that teaching a lesson entirely in L1 is extremely ineffective, especially for productive skills. That is my point. At some point we can go either way, but there are basic practices that should be followed by anyone. I mean, I’m agreeing with you here, but I’m saying that we can only take it so far.

]]> By: Darren Elliott http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/comment-page-1/#comment-10 Darren Elliott Wed, 14 Oct 2009 13:55:03 +0000 http://turklishtefl.com/?p=90#comment-10 This is the kind of thing I was referring to in my "do-as-you-please" blog post, Nick! I haven't come across a study, but I GUARANTEE that there is a direct correlation between NEST's L1 ability and their attitudes towards L1 in the classroom. I mean, if you speak great Turkish then I'm pretty sure you'll be using it. If you can barely order dinner, your classroom will be English immersion. Well, that's natural enough - but what is funny is that both teachers will be able to dig up bucket loads of research to support them, and both approaches DO have validity. However, both teachers are actually just 'doing as they please', teaching in a way that they are makes them happy and comfortable. Isn't that justification enough? ;P This is the kind of thing I was referring to in my “do-as-you-please” blog post, Nick! I haven’t come across a study, but I GUARANTEE that there is a direct correlation between NEST’s L1 ability and their attitudes towards L1 in the classroom. I mean, if you speak great Turkish then I’m pretty sure you’ll be using it. If you can barely order dinner, your classroom will be English immersion. Well, that’s natural enough – but what is funny is that both teachers will be able to dig up bucket loads of research to support them, and both approaches DO have validity. However, both teachers are actually just ‘doing as they please’, teaching in a way that they are makes them happy and comfortable. Isn’t that justification enough? ;P

]]> By: Diana http://turklishtefl.com/2009/09/30/using-turkish-in-the-classroom/comment-page-1/#comment-6 Diana Sun, 11 Oct 2009 12:23:55 +0000 http://turklishtefl.com/?p=90#comment-6 Nick, I'm happy you wrote about this! I definitely agree that Turkish should not be completely banned in class and that we should create engaging enough lessons so that they will want to communicate in English. I undoubtedly try not to use Turkish in class but I find that for some things a few Turkish words can make a world of difference and can really help them to understand something like..... Question Tags! :) I have to admit that I start that lesson by mentioning the Turkish "de?il mi?". I basically tell them that while they have just this one question tag, ours varies depending on the verbs used. This really helps a lot. From square one they're on the ball and know what's going on. So instead spending lots of time with them trying to figure our what question tags are... they know up front and now focus their time on understanding how the English ones work and when to use them: cant we?, can we?, don't I?, doesn't he?, etc. I definitely agree that literal word-for-word translations are a big "No, no!". lol. As I am someone who is learning Turkish, I know first hand that direct translations don't work most of the time! I have also learned Turkish-English dictionaries can definitely not be trusted. I insist that my students use a dictionary ONLY as last resort if they truly can't understand my explanations, drawings, acting, etc. I always get laughs when I announce, "Put that book away. I am your dictionary now!" But if I don't say it, they'll just keep on running to the dictionary. I found that part about our ability to speak Turkish interesting. About how you said that if we can speak Turkish they have this new respect for us. I completely agree. I find that the students faces immediately light up, and the students sit up straighter and more attentive after hearing that I'm learning Turkish. Turks love hearing that you love their culture, language, cities, country, people, etc. They love when I make sentences like the following: "I always drink ayran when I eat lahmacun." Or "I prefer Ali Nazik to çi? köfte." They get a real kick out of it. I think it's important that our example sentences that they can relate to easily. When teaching "Before" and "After" I also try to make sentences that relate to them the most. I give an example regarding abdest (the Islamic cleansing before prayer) and namaz (Islamic prayer, also known as salaat). They really like that I show interest in their culture, food, religion, etc. So, back to "before" and "after".. You know, I actually didn't realise how confusing "before" and "after" was.. until I learned it in Turkish. Now I can understand what a mess of confusion they go through trying to figure out which thing comes first and which comes second. I use an example which all Turks know, that NEVER changes: "Before I do namaz(pray), I do abdest(Islamic cleansing)." and "After I do abdest, I do namaz." This is a good example because it's something that people worldwide ALWAYS do EXACTLY in the SAME ORDER. I usually find my students to be very surprised by this example. However, they are always very happy about it because they can understand it without having to analyze it too much. Anyway.. I just keep babbling on... :) This is a great site Nick! Thanks for your insights! I know that you have personally helped me a lot these past few months with some wonderful teaching ideas. Your games have been a HUGE hit with my classes! They really help to get everybody involved and speaking English, even the quiet ones. :) Thank you! Diana Nick,

I’m happy you wrote about this! I definitely agree that Turkish should not be completely banned in class and that we should create engaging enough lessons so that they will want to communicate in English. I undoubtedly try not to use Turkish in class but I find that for some things a few Turkish words can make a world of difference and can really help them to understand something like….. Question Tags! :) I have to admit that I start that lesson by mentioning the Turkish “de?il mi?”. I basically tell them that while they have just this one question tag, ours varies depending on the verbs used. This really helps a lot. From square one they’re on the ball and know what’s going on. So instead spending lots of time with them trying to figure our what question tags are… they know up front and now focus their time on understanding how the English ones work and when to use them: cant we?, can we?, don’t I?, doesn’t he?, etc.

I definitely agree that literal word-for-word translations are a big “No, no!”. lol. As I am someone who is learning Turkish, I know first hand that direct translations don’t work most of the time! I have also learned Turkish-English dictionaries can definitely not be trusted. I insist that my students use a dictionary ONLY as last resort if they truly can’t understand my explanations, drawings, acting, etc. I always get laughs when I announce, “Put that book away. I am your dictionary now!” But if I don’t say it, they’ll just keep on running to the dictionary.

I found that part about our ability to speak Turkish interesting. About how you said that if we can speak Turkish they have this new respect for us. I completely agree. I find that the students faces immediately light up, and the students sit up straighter and more attentive after hearing that I’m learning Turkish. Turks love hearing that you love their culture, language, cities, country, people, etc. They love when I make sentences like the following: “I always drink ayran when I eat lahmacun.” Or “I prefer Ali Nazik to çi? köfte.” They get a real kick out of it. I think it’s important that our example sentences that they can relate to easily.

When teaching “Before” and “After” I also try to make sentences that relate to them the most. I give an example regarding abdest (the Islamic cleansing before prayer) and namaz (Islamic prayer, also known as salaat). They really like that I show interest in their culture, food, religion, etc. So, back to “before” and “after”.. You know, I actually didn’t realise how confusing “before” and “after” was.. until I learned it in Turkish. Now I can understand what a mess of confusion they go through trying to figure out which thing comes first and which comes second. I use an example which all Turks know, that NEVER changes:

“Before I do namaz(pray), I do abdest(Islamic cleansing).” and “After I do abdest, I do namaz.”

This is a good example because it’s something that people worldwide ALWAYS do EXACTLY in the SAME ORDER. I usually find my students to be very surprised by this example. However, they are always very happy about it because they can understand it without having to analyze it too much.

Anyway.. I just keep babbling on… :) This is a great site Nick! Thanks for your insights! I know that you have personally helped me a lot these past few months with some wonderful teaching ideas. Your games have been a HUGE hit with my classes! They really help to get everybody involved and speaking English, even the quiet ones. :)

Thank you!
Diana

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